[00:00:00] Alicia Boddy: How can durable skills help today’s students, educators, and business leaders reinvent the profile of learners and workers? What do we mean when we say profile? And how do we define reinventing? That’s what we’ll discuss in this final episode of our three part series, The Durable Skills Advantage.
[00:00:20] Welcome again. I’m Alicia Abadie, Vice President of Partnerships at America Succeeds. america Succeeds is a nonprofit organization committed to engaging business leaders and modernizing education systems. We’ve positioned our team between business and the education policy sector, acting as an education voice to business, nationally, and a business voice for education at the state level.
[00:00:48] our advocacy work and policy efforts aim at larger culture change, bridging these two distinct constituencies. And our vision is preparing every student to succeed in the competitive global economy and contribute to their local communities. We We believe identifying durable skills, clarifying these competencies, and articulating their value for employers, educators, and learners of all ages are ways to realize this vision. Thanks for joining us for this concluding conversation. Once again, we go back to the conversation between Stephanie Short, my predecessor here, and Tim Taylor, co founder and president of America Succeeds.
[00:01:31] And in this session They bring an end to this durable skills discussion by taking us back to the beginning.
[00:01:39] Tim Taylor: Let’s then take it back to the beginning and how we got to this spot in the first place. And I think that is by taking a look at some of the research that we’ve done So with our partners at MC Burning Glass now rebranded Lightcast, we looked at over 80 million job descriptions across the country and found that seven of the top 10 most in demand skills are durable skills. We’ve also then partnered with CompTIA to create a framework about what employers are expecting somebody to know and do as it relates to these skills. And we started for somebody who was in the 22 to 24 year old’s time frame in their lives when they’re really entering their first real work job.
[00:02:18] What we found is that , these are the types of skills that employers are seeking. In fact, there’s only a handful of roles that typically tend to be low skill, low wage jobs that don’t need a bunch of these skills. But the high skill, high wage, and the mid skill, mid wage jobs, this is what they’re all about.
[00:02:37] Of course, there is a technical component that goes along to it, but in the early stage career, they tend to be a little less important than some of these durable skills.
[00:02:44] Stephanie Short: So much of identifying a profile of a graduate, a profile of a learner, or a profile of a worker means clearly articulating which durable skills are critical for succeeding in that job.
[00:02:58] Or succeeding in any job. I think that’s such an important part of the conversation today as well, grounding this in that common lexicon that we’ve created. And we know from our experience going across the country that a major challenge has been around the language of this skill set, that oftentimes employers are using two different skills, but the same word to describe somewhat alike skills, but landing in that perfect spot where when we say this is good communication, this is good leadership, this is good collaboration.
[00:03:34] Creates a myriad of opportunities for us to expand pathways from education to the workforce and pathways into economic mobility. Let’s dig a little bit further into the conversation. There are three groups that can really benefit from engaging with the Durable Skills Advantage Framework. The framework itself has value for business leaders and employers, it has value for educators, and it has value for students.
[00:04:04] How do you imagine some of this work coming to life in the near term?
[00:04:08] Tim Taylor: let’s dig in on the students piece first, These are skills that employers are looking for. But unless we start to create a pipeline of those young people coming out, learners, and ultimately those are going to be workers, who need these skills. So what’s happening, unfortunately, schools today is that there’s a lot of demands on teachers and the sector what they need to teach students in the classroom.
[00:04:32] Educators have said decades, for probably all eternity, that what we’re looking for is well rounded kids. They want to teach the whole child. And so this is a powerful way to do that. Because quantifiable skills in some way. We know that employers are looking for them. We can look at the demand side of that.
[00:04:48] And so this is a really good way to embed those types of skills in the academics. And then finally, I already mentioned a little bit about the employer side, the business leaders. Who are desperate for these types of skills in all of their roles. And we see that with their incumbent workforce. And we see that when they’re hiring young talent or early stage career folks as well. Pretty powerful in terms of the types of skills and what they’re able to do to advance somebody’s career and economic mobility.
[00:05:13] Stephanie Short: I couldn’t agree more. I think that’s the world that we’re hoping for, that on some level every student has an opportunity to sit down, or learner has an opportunity to sit down, whether they’re thinking about college, or they’re thinking about going straight into the workforce, or exploring another pathway, and they can clearly articulate
[00:05:34] I practice collaboration in my science class when I practice critical thinking in my literature classes when, and be able to really tell those stories using the same language that employers are using to connect people to opportunities within their companies. so, getting a little more tactical in this final of our three episodes.
[00:05:57] Let’s talk about ways that Durable Skills and the Durable Skills Advantage Framework have come to life I think the opportunity top of mind for me is in the portrait or profile of a graduate. At the same time that there’s been a lot of cultural recognition around whole child learning.
[00:06:18] around durable skills. We have also seen the growing popularity of portrait or profiles of a graduate at both the school and state level. So can you talk to me a little bit about what that looks like and how that opportunity can move the needle forward in K 12?
[00:06:36] Tim Taylor: Sure I think one of the powerful things about these portraits of a graduate that we’re seeing across the country are the community and stakeholder engagement. They’re bringing groups of folks together to decide what they think somebody should look like, what this portrait should look like, when they get to the end of their high school career. It’s a really robust portrait in many cases. What we’re also seeing is that a number of durable skills show up in these portraits. And I think that just back on what communities are looking for and what they know young people are going to need to have in terms of skills to be successful in today’s world. real challenge is once you have a portrait is to change a learner’s experience so that you might ever have those young people look like the portrait the time in which we’re striving to have them.
[00:07:25] graduate and go off into either college or career.
[00:07:28] Stephanie Short: I’ll shout out our friends in North Carolina here. It was actually someone from the Department of Public Instruction who told me the worst thing that could happen is if our portrait of a graduate stays a flat Stanley. So Many of these portraits turn into a beautiful graphic that sits on the wall, yet they haven’t taken meaningful steps to also change that classroom experience so that the kids graduating look like the portrait that they’ve hung up on the wall.
[00:07:58] Now, a key lever in making that shift, and I think something I’m excited about as we look across K 12 and even reimagining post secondary experiences, is the increased emphasis being put on work based learning and career connected learning to bring out these skills. And so when you think about work based learning, Tim, what comes to mind for you as sort of key elements to set yourself up for success?
[00:08:24] Tim Taylor: giving kids an opportunity to experience what the work environment looks like and the types of skills that they need. When we talk to young people who have had one of these experiences, particularly as we were developing the framework around durable skills is.
[00:08:36] In the classroom, oftentimes they said, boy, young people might not be able to demonstrate these types of skills and these young people who have already been in some type of work environment are saying, no, I’m asked to do that every day when I’m on the job. So they’re seeing it in a way that you just don’t get it in the typical classroom.
[00:08:53] I think all the listeners, everybody can relate to that idea of how different the workforce experience is and what your colleagues and peers are looking for. When you show up the office. I think in many ways, many people have seen inverse of that. When somebody doesn’t have these skills how difficult it is for them to be successful in their role. these programs that are out there for work based learning and, things where young people really have a taste and hands on experiences are so powerful because they see and feel and experience what that looks like.
[00:09:23] Stephanie Short: Employers Employers have often asked what is it that they can do to advance some of this work and schools that are really focused or programs that are really focused on work based learning opportunities are typically in desperate need of employer partnerships, but those partnerships don’t have to be as formal as full on internship programs or full on apprenticeship programs.
[00:09:48] Sometimes those partnerships are as simple as a meet a pro conversation with a student or giving them a tour of a facility so they can see sort of the depth and breadth of what happens behind closed walls. Or, in a lot of cases, some best in class programs are really oriented around specific project based learning in partnership with businesses in their community.
[00:10:11] wHat’s the 10th thing on your to do list , and turning that over for high schoolers to deliver some value in new and interesting ways. And we see that across programs like CAPS and NAF, who are great partners of ours, GPS Education, as well as on the post secondary side, platforms and programs like RIPEN that offer digital work based learning experiences, or Simba, who’s a great partner of ours who expands.
[00:10:37] digital internship experiences. There’s a lot of ways and a lot of opportunities for employers to engage so that durable skills aren’t something that just happens on a worksheet, but durable skills are something that are developed and learned in context with employer partnerships across the country.
[00:10:57] Tim Taylor: , as powerful as these programs are, they still are reaching a small minority of students, and so while these are so rich in conveying durable skills, experiences, and practicing those experiences. I Think we both agree that what’s happening is they’re not getting it in math and English and science and the other things, and they need a pipeline of those things happening until they can reach those work based learning experiences or internships or other types of things when they’re sort in their junior, senior year as the students are maturing a little bit.
[00:11:27] but it’s a both and, and I know we both are really passionate about that.
[00:11:31] Stephanie Short: that brings to mind the old adage from the ed reform world, right? Is what gets measured is ultimately what matters. And so doing this work at scale means oftentimes thinking about shifting measurement, shifting accountability writ large. So to your point, Tim, it’s not just the lucky few who are really engaged in these work based learning experiences, but every student who has the opportunity to develop durable skills.
[00:12:01] And I think that’s ultimately a big part of our strategy and a big part of our work is thinking about shifting to more holistic assessment and shifting to more holistic.
[00:12:18] And so talk to me a little bit more about that intersection point, the Durable Skills Advantage Framework, and the opportunity to think about measurement more broadly.
[00:12:28] Tim Taylor: kudos to the federal government on this one because they opened up alternative metrics to measure student success. States can now explore different opportunities. And this, I think, is an extraordinary one for states to look at because it’s so meaningful.
[00:12:42] And there are these other programs that are coming out. uh, Mastery Transcript Consortium, who’s a great partner of ours, who is looking at different ways to demonstrate mastery or that a student has learned something through portfolios or strength finders or these other types of things.
[00:12:56] there’s a lot of student agency in that as well, because these come down to young people , when you ask them, Hey, what are you good at? Or what do you like to do? They can put together great answers to that because they’ve have such a deep buy in and they understand what they’re good at
[00:13:09] and back to the top of the conversation, they have a vocabulary around a lot of these skills that match what employers are asking for. And we keep saying employers, but I should say. With a couple of kids in college, I desperately want them to have and be practicing these skills while they’re at a four year university.
[00:13:25] so You can’t expect somebody to be a 10 for 10 on durable skills. That just doesn’t happen. But understanding where your strengths and weaknesses are and then looking for. opportunities that exist in the world where you can showcase those strengths, right?
[00:13:37] Stephanie Short: Technology evolves so rapidly today, it is impossible to predict what jobs are going to be there for students in the future. And we used to frame that, even just a few years ago, as like, we can’t predict what jobs will be available for today’s kindergartners.
[00:13:54] And I would easily argue that now we can’t predict what jobs are going to be available for our college students, right? Like even in just a couple years, the workforce is changing so quickly. And so that combination of durable skills and understanding your strengths, and also having the opportunity to explore and dig into your interests and build some agency, plus then having the table stakes of some core academics and maybe some In demand technical skills are really what sets someone up for success.
[00:14:26] Because we can’t predict those jobs, because we don’t know what’s coming, helping today’s students understand what problems they want to solve and how they’re inclined to lean into those problems makes me way more hopeful about the future and the future workforce and what we’ll accomplish in the face of all this change.
[00:14:45] But there’s one final piece of this that we can’t leave off the table and that’s truly the professional development side of this work. really asking people to rethink or reimagine how they’re engaging with learners and I don’t know that even if it’s a small adjustment or a small shift that every educator is equipped to do that, nor is any professional learning and development person necessarily equipped to do this.
[00:15:14] So, Tim, what are your thoughts on the opportunities related? to professional development, in this space.
[00:15:20] Tim Taylor: Let’s start by saying that educators who are in the classroom are doing Yeoman’s work. They are extraordinary. Their love for kids and their love for learning and preparing kids for the world is extraordinary. And we’ve asked them to do a lot and we keep piling on with other things every time we think of Some type of new flavor or sauce that we want to sprinkle in here where we’re asking them to take that on as well. think one of the things that is unique to Durable Skills is it isn’t necessarily new content. It’s not asking them to do more, it’s asking them to do different. It’s how you teach math by using critical thinking, maybe asking the kids to collaborate. now You could ask groups of kids to get together in a group and solve problems, or present those problems back to their class using communication skills, and the classroom teaching is still the same, whether they’re learning fractions or whether they’re learning geometry, it doesn’t matter.
[00:16:11] And the same goes for all these other subjects. think the real opportunity around professional development is helping teachers with those skills, what that looks like, what we want them to do, and what they want to be doing themselves.
[00:16:23] So it is using those things that are happening in the classroom while they’re teaching their curriculum that they are so good at delivering on their own. It is asking them to do other things with it. So how would you add to ensure that kids have a growth mindset or how would you be sure that they’re using some creativity skills in some of these things, right?
[00:16:42] So asking them to do that throughout the day in different classes and having it be consistently delivered the true opportunity of how a classroom might look different over the next few years. And I think it’s, our job uh, among others to figure out what are great ways to assess or evaluate.
[00:16:58] but I do think we need to. Make sure that all teachers realize that it is their responsibility and it is an enormous opportunity to use the Durable Skills Wheel that is available on the DurableSkills.
[00:17:09] org website and just grab these terms. Teach the kids what these terms mean, the common lexicon that exists. There are now tools out there to make this a lot easier for folks and we’d love to build an army behind it of folks who believe and who want to make sure that kids are prepared.
[00:17:23] Stephanie Short: And that’s the key telling the kids that these are the skills that they’re learning. So many educators , have already brought learner centered and sort of project and competency based models into their practice and strategies and their classrooms look that way, but just this simple idea of reminding kids that today you are also going to practice.
[00:17:43] critical thinking and collaboration and creativity alongside these math problems or alongside this reading or in your Spanish class. And so, I think there’s a ton of opportunity there to just unlock a new type of learning new approaches to scaffolding to set people up for success. The same can be said on the employer and adult training side.
[00:18:07] I think something we heard really early on in this work from one of our subject matter experts was that oftentimes the managers who are overseeing frontline talent are also lacking in these durable skills. And it is important, whether it’s talking about it through company culture, bringing it up through ongoing training programs.
[00:18:30] in modeling this behavior from the top all the way down, that also on the employer side, we’re thinking about durable skills and durable skills development in these same sort of robust ways.
[00:18:42] Tim Taylor: Yeah, I think that’s a fantastic point. Um, And hiring is competitive. Upscaling an incumbent workforce is typically a much better investment than losing somebody and starting from scratch. And I think as the workforce continues to tighten , over future years. There’s huge opportunities for companies to invest in their employees and to train them up and re skill and up skill them in, durable skills and prepare them for growth within their company
[00:19:08] Stephanie Short: we have joked a lot that some of this work feels like boiling the ocean. There is frankly so much opportunity ahead of us. But those four things we talked about today I think are by far the most actionable at this moment in time. First, encourage community and stakeholder involvement in creating your local portrait of a graduate or portrait of a learner. Second, develop employer partnerships. Make sure that the education systems in your region are connected to employers and connected to opportunities around in demand jobs. Shift to holistic assessment, whether that’s on the K 12 side or as an employer, thinking about recruiting and retaining your employees. Make sure that durable skills are valued and reviewed alongside technical skills at a really regular pace. And finally, invest in professional development. I cannot stress this enough.
[00:20:13] At every level of your organization, and throughout K 12, the professional development of those managing, training, and leading other individuals is key to unlocking durable skills at scale and greater economic vitality for years to come.
[00:20:32] We’re starting sort of one step at a time, one piece at a time, and eventually we’ll heat things up enough that we actually do boil the ocean. On that note, that’s a wrap for our three part series, thanks as always for joining this conversation, Tim. And thank you for listening. Let’s keep the conversation going. Bye for now!
[00:20:54] Alicia Boddy: Want to know more about Durable Skills and the ADDvantage Framework? Visit us at DurableSkillsAdvantage. org. That’s DurableSkillsAdvantage, as one word, dot org. There, you’ll learn the ways we’re helping individuals, communities, and businesses improve pathways from education to the workforce.
[00:21:18] and unlock career success. And you can download the Durable Skills Advantage Framework Starter Edition. Thank you for listening.
